Gods country?

Ya’ll are horrible this nation was founded on God, and now that people have “feelings” everything has to change this world is going down. If you have stupid feelings you don’t need to be in the military or go to war.


Dear (name withheld),

This nation was not founded on god! I’m fact the founding fathers looked at Rhode Island and copied the concept of Roger Williams design to enact a separation of church and state.

You see Roger Williams was an ordained minister so devout in his faith that he looked down upon the Puritans for not being godly enough, but he felt that it was an insult and disdainful towards God, himself, if he forced others to adhere to his beliefs. So he left New England and founded Rhode Island – the worlds first place to have freedom of religion. It was so tolerant that Native Americans migrated there in order to be free from proselytization and to worship their own gods freely and openly.

Of the first four founding fathers only James Madison was an open Christian. The first three were Deists.
But Madison so forcefully believed in the separation that he refused to swear in on a Bible and refused to give federal funds to churches in the DC area no matter how noble a cause they were pursuing.

If you truly want to go back to how religion was treated by the government at the founding of this nation I will follow you. Raise your banner and let’s start something truly patriotic and noble.

Otherwise shut up and read a college level history book!

Very Respectfully,
Paul Loebe
Special Projects Manager
Military Religious Freedom Foundation


Dear (name withheld),

I have been asked to respond to your email, below. Based on simple internet search, you are a real person and your email address is, likewise, real, so this email should reach you.

It’s clear that you have learned a lot about our nation from listening to authority figures whom you respect and admire. You would likely have a strong respect for chain of command in the military, including the Civil Air Patrol.

Now, no one can possibly learn everything, but each of us must learn what we need to know to handle our responsibilities appropriately, and that includes legally. For example, if your commander ordered you to do something illegal, did you know it would be illegal for you to carry out that command? You could, if found out, be brought up on UMCJ charges, court marshalled, and thrown into the penitentiary for a long time.

Just like you, even the members of your chain of command are only human and can only know so much. Sure, some illegal orders should be obvious. That’s why the Nuremburg trials were effective: None of the plaintiffs could claim, “I was just following orders when murdering all those innocent civilians, women and children included, who stood freezing and weaponless, rounded up with no place to run.”

Even your preacher cannot truly claim to know everything, though your religious rant suggests you take every word as gospel.

Therefore, it is incumbent upon you to take what is told to you, look it up, and find out how true it is. Some like to quote President Reagan for saying, “Trust, but verify.” He wasn’t the first to say it. It still and will always be sage advice. Be sure to look into reliable sources of fact, not just the “echo chamber” of voices which reiterate what you want to believe without providing clear evidence — date, source, page, and, perhaps most importantly, context — which you can, then, go to and check for truth.

As it turns out, the farthest thing from the truth is that the United States of America was founded on God. The various groups of people who came here, ostensibly for religious freedom, including a majority who believed in God and in Jesus — majority, not totality, mind you — and yet, each faction believed their freedom of religion required every other faction to believe and worship exactly the way they did or suffer for it.

Why else do you think Christianity is broken down into Protestants and Catholics and, let’s not forget, Eastern Orthodox and Coptic Christians and other groups at least as old or older than Catholics? The Protestants are rather new, and they’ve broken down into far more factions: Seventh Day Adventists, Church of Christ vs. United Church of Christ, Methodist, Baptist vs. Southern Baptist vs. many other Baptist sects, Episcopalian — both low and high sects of Episcopalian, in fact — and more. There are too many to count. Each thinks it’s the one true and right way to be a Christian. And then, there are the “nondenominational” Christians which, as researchers now recognize, count as a denomination or group of denomination, too.

Our Founding Fathers recognized that each religiously separate group of colonists, if left to do what they believed was right, would war with the others until one controlled all, and that wouldn’t be the end of it, as the others would regroup and rebel to obtain control. In today’s world, you can see the same inter-religious war for domination occurring in the Middle East, between Sunni, Shia, Wahabi, and other sects of Islam. (If only they’d had Founding Fathers like ours, they’d have been better off.) Not even a generation ago, there was such vicious and deadly fighting in Ireland, between Catholics and Protestants, and it had gone on for many generations. The history of wars between factions of Christianity starts fairly soon after Jesus and continues to this day, though today, it is far more hidden. Ask, and I will give you information on that, too, in hopes that you will check it out for yourself, rather than simply believe me.

Our Founding Fathers, in their unbelievable courage, dignity, and honesty, went a step farther than any the world had ever seen, in their time. They recognized that, even if one Christian sect won and maintained control, it would abuse its governmental powers, and that those who weren’t even Christian would be at particular risk. Many, if not most, of our Founding Fathers, themselves, would have been considered “heretics” for their questioning of God and of Jesus. (For example, look up Jefferson’s Bible, in which Thomas Jefferson cut out every reference to anything supernatural, and then, had the bible he preferred. If I recall correctly, it sits inside the Library of Congress, and so you might be able to google a scanned copy over the internet.)

Therefore, they did the unthinkable: They decided to make government and religion separate, and to keep it that way for all time. This, they believed, would not only protect government from corruption by thugs hiding behind a veil of religious powermongering, but it would also protect any and all religious sects from being bullied through the power of governmental forces.

Now, you seem to think what’s going on, today, between MRFF and our military services is all about “feelings.” I am an honorably discharged veteran, a former officer of one branch of our military, and I can tell you: It is about following the law. When one religious sect claims control over our military — and, worse, through lies made of historical revision — that military’s forces become weapons in the hands of madmen.

Perhaps one day, a chaplain will wake from a dream, contact his follower in the chain of command which controls even one nuclear missile, and tell him that Jesus came to him and said it was time to start Armageddon. Perhaps the chaplain won’t even be needed, and the military member will wake from his own dream, thinking that. Do you really expect such a person to check for permission from the chain of command above him? No Commander in Chief will be able to stop such a madman, before it’s too late.

This is my greatest fear. There are substantial reasons for this fear, from our military’s recent histories of such things as “Jesus Rifles” and “Nukes for Jesus” training programs, just to name only two.

So, please understand that what MRFF is trying to do goes beyond protecting peoples’ “feelings”.

There is so much more I could explain to you, but this email is far too long, as it is. I wish you all the best, including great knowledge and courage, so that you can be a hero you so clearly wish to be. Thank you for your service and for trying, with all your heart, to be a patriotic American. We need more than your heart, of course. We need your well-educated head engaged in this service.

Sincerely,
A military veteran and staunch supporter of MRFF who is still targeted for not going to the right church

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