Glorifying war in the name of Jesus

There is a bible of Jesus. Everything Christ said was in red type.
 
If you want to live a truly spiritual life, see with new eyes and be like a little child again, an innocent,jim before the pain and tears in the fabric of our personalities caused us to divide each other and make war.
 
If one is secure in his philosophy and religion; Spirituality, really, he has no problem allowing other people to worship
or honor the one true power in their own way.
 
Peace to you and yours, and to all people that want compassion and kindness that comes from the disarmament that begins in our own heart.
 
In light and love,

(name withheld)


Response from MRFF Advisory Board Member Joan Slish

As a Christian, I am fully aware of the Red Letter Bible. 
 
I live my life according to the Beatitudes, Sermon on the Mount, “love your neighbor as yourself” and “as you done it unto the least of these you have done it unto Me.”
 

We are neither an atheist organization nor are we anti-Christian. Mikey is Jewish (and prays to the same Father we do 3 times a day) and 80% of the Board, Advisory Board, volunteers and supporters (300 in total) of the Military Religious Freedom Foundation (MRFF) are Christians. In fact, 96% of our 50,000+ soldier clients are mainline Christians and we fight for them more than any other belief or non-belief.

 

We are not making war against Christianity. Our government is secular (including the military) and has laws and rules regarding religious neutrality in any of its entities.

 

We also have many honorable and distinguished military personnel whom we rely on for their expertise on religion in the military, on our Board and Advisory Board.

https://www.militaryreligiousfreedom.org/about/foundation-voices/

 

Check out our Mission Statement

https://www.militaryreligiousfreedom.org/about/our-mission/

 

As defenders of the Constitution we fight for the Separation of Church and State.

 

“…but no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States.” (Article I, III)

This means that from the President to Congress to the military – no one’s job is based on their religion.

 

“Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion (Establishment Clause), or prohibiting the free exercise thereof (Free Exercise Clause).”(First Amendment)

 

The Establishment Clause means that you cannot favor one religion over another even though it is in the majority. This clause respects the RIGHTS of all religions. Our military is SECULAR and there are people of other faiths that don the uniform that love this country. 

 

The Free Exercise Clause (which is subservient to the Establishment Clause) means that our soldiers are free to exercise any religion they want or no religion at all but cannot elevate one God above others.

 

“Because religious belief, or non-belief, is such an important part of every person’s life, freedom of religion affects every individual. Religious institutions that use government power in support of themselves and force their views on persons of other faiths, or of no faith, undermine all our civil rights. Moreover, state support of an established religion tends to make the clergy unresponsive to their own people, and leads to corruption within religion itself. Erecting the “wall of separation between church and state,” therefore, is absolutely essential in a free society.” Thomas Jefferson, to the Virginia Baptists (1808) ME 16:320. 
 
This is his second known use of the term “wall of separation,” here quoting his own use in the Danbury Baptist letter.
 
This wording of the original was several times upheld by the Supreme Court as an accurate description of the Establishment Clause.
 
“Jefferson’s concept of “separation of church and state” first became a part of Establishment Clause jurisprudence in Reynolds v. U.S., 98 U.S. 145 (1878). In that case, the court examined the history of religious liberty in the US, determining that while the constitution guarantees religious freedom, “The word ‘religion’ is not defined in the Constitution. We must go elsewhere, therefore, to ascertain its meaning and nowhere more appropriately, we think, than to the history of the times in the midst of which the provision was adopted.” The court found that the leaders in advocating and formulating the constitutional guarantee of religious liberty were James Madison and Thomas Jefferson. Quoting the “separation” paragraph from Jefferson’s letter to the Danbury Baptists, the court concluded that, “coming as this does from an acknowledged leader of the advocates of the measure, it may be accepted almost as an authoritative declaration of the scope and effect of the amendment thus secured.
 
In 1878 “separation of church and state” became part of the Establishment Clause by law.
 
The Supreme Court heard the Lemon v. Kurtzman case in 1971 and ruled in favor of the Establishment Clause.
 
Subsequent to this decision, the Supreme Court has applied a three-pronged test to determine whether government action comports with the Establishment Clause, known as the Lemon Test:
 
Government action violates the Establishment Clause unless it: 
1. has a significant secular (i.e., non-religious) purpose, 
2. does not have the primary effect of advancing or inhibiting religion 
3. does not foster excessive entanglement between government and religion
 

Parker v. Levy: 

 “This Court has long recognized that the military is, by necessity, a specialized society separate from civilian society… While the members of the military are not excluded from the protection granted by the First Amendment, the different character of the military community and of the military mission requires a different application of those protections. … The fundamental necessity for obedience, and the consequent necessity for imposition of discipline, may render permissible within the military that which would be constitutionally impermissible outside it… Speech [in any form] that is protected in the civil population may nonetheless undermine the effectiveness of response to command.  If it does, it is constitutionally unprotected.” (Emphasis added) Parker v. Levy, 417 U.S. 733, 1974

 

AFI (Air Force Instruction) 1-1, Section 2.12:
 2.12. Balance of Free Exercise of Religion and Establishment Clause. Leaders at all levels must balance constitutional protections for their own free exercise of religion, including individual expressions of religious beliefs, and the constitutional prohibition against governmental establishment of religion. They must ensure their words and actions cannot reasonably be construed to be officially endorsing or disapproving of, or extending preferential treatment for any faith, belief, or absence of belief. 
 

To use our military to advance the Christian religion above all others is in violation of the Constitution (Establishment Clause), Reynolds v. U.S., Lemon v. Kurtzman, the Lemon Test, Parker v. Levy and AFI 1-1, Section 2.12.

 

Yes, religion has been responsible for many wars.

 

In his Notes on Virginia (1782), Jefferson wrote: “Millions of innocent men, women and children since the introduction of Christianity have been burnt, tortured, fined, imprisoned. Yet we have not advanced one inch towards uniformity. What has been the effect of coercion? To make one half the world fools and the other half hypocrites. . .”
 

“History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people maintaining a free civil government. This marks the lowest grade of ignorance of which their civil as well as religious leaders will always avail themselves for their own purposes.”

Thomas Jefferson: in letter to Alexander von Humboldt, December 6, 1813

“The civil government functions with complete success by the total separation of the Church from the State.”
James Madison, 1819, Writings, 8:432, quoted from Gene Garman, “Essays In Addition to America’s Real Religion

“Strongly guarded as is the separation between Religion and Government in the Constitution of the United States, the danger of encroachment by Ecclesiastical Bodies, may be illustrated by precedents already furnished in their short history.”

James Madison; Monopolies, Perpetuities, Corporations, Ecclesiastical Endowments

 

“Where the preamble declares, that coercion is a departure from the plan of the holy author of our religion, an amendment was proposed by inserting “Jesus Christ,” so that it would read “A departure from the plan of Jesus Christ, the holy author of our religion;” the insertion was rejected by the great majority, in proof that they meant to comprehend, within the mantle of its protection, the Jew and the Gentile, the Christian and Mohammedan, the Hindoo and Infidel of every denomination.”

As Thomas Jefferson wrote in his Autobiography, in reference to the Virginia Act for Religious Freedom

 

Peace to you and yours.

 

Joan Slish

MRFF Advisory Board Member


Response from MRFF Supporter Mike Challman

Good Evening,  (name withheld) –
Thanks for taking the time to write to the MRFF.  Mikey Weinstein has read your email (he reads all correspondence we receive) and asked me to reply. I’m a volunteer to supports the MRFF in a variety of ways, including email correspondence.  I’m also a lifelong, committed, and active Christian; a USAF Academy graduate (’85); and a veteran USAF officer.
The impression I get from your email is that you’ve written primarily to express your witness to our Christian faith. I certainly understand and appreciate the gesture.  You should understand that there is no one at the MRFF who would deny your right to practice and express your religious beliefs in this manner. Unfortunately and all too often, the MRFF is portrayed by some media sources as being anti-religion, anti-religious freedom, or both.  Nothing could be further from the truth.
There is one comment in your email that makes me curious.  You mention that someone who is “secure in his philosophy and religion” would have “no problem allowing other people to worship or honor the one true power”.  It’s that last bit about the “one true power” that has me curious about your position with respect to religious freedom. You seem to suggest that religious freedom should be reserved only for those who worship the God whom you (and I) worship.
Rather, I’d ask that you contemplate this perspective —
We support true religious freedom when we have no problem allowing other people to worship or not worship, honor or not honor, and believe or not believe in God… and even more so when we support the right of another citizen to hold a belief (or unbelief) with which we strongly disagree and believe to be untrue.
Those are just some of the core values which inform what we do at the MRFF.  Thanks again for writing.
Peace,
Mike Challman
Christian, USAF veteran, MRFF supporter

Thank you Mike,

 My statement to the one true power, is in reference to The Great Mystery as spoken about in the first American’s religion.
Christopher Columbus got lost and thought America was India, and called the “Human Beings” , as they called themselves, “Indians”.
I was raised Roman Catholic and went to church, catechism and heard thousands of sermons and read the bible.
When I reached 13 I felt Original sin, Heaven and Hell didn’t make sense to me. I read many occult texts and studied Buddhism, more a philosophy than a religion.
I now realize I am attuned to Tibetan Buddhism and Sufism because of the compassion and kindness for oneself and all people.
To appeal to a vast number of people, that would be amenable to this philosophy, I said the One True Power. As in the 12 step program your higher self or one’s higher power.
Acceptance and non egoistic refusal of the dualism; pervasive in our culture, I chose to see all as one and Spirituality as something very different than playing the game of joining a group or religion as an automaton.
Thank you for writing, I responded to the base email spouted by an anonymous writer that was anti-Semitic and thoughtless, but I guess his anonymity was his strongest point but essentially, cowardly.
In peace,
(name withheld)

Response from MRFF Supporter Mike Challman
Dear (name withheld),
Thank you for the continued correspondence, (name withheld).  I think I understand what you are saying.  Let me give you a little bit more about MRFF principles values, which should confirm that we are on the same page.

As you may know, the central focus of the MRFF is Constitutional protections for all US military members.  We were founded upon a dedication to ensure that all members of the United States Armed Forces fully receive the Constitutional guarantees of religious freedom to which they and all Americans are entitled by virtue of the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment.
Our mission statement also includes the following highlights (you can find the full Mission Statement at mrff.org in the “About” section):

No religion or religious philosophy may be advanced by the United States Armed Forces over any other religion or religious philosophy.
No member of the United States Armed Forces may be compelled in any way to conform to a particular religion or religious philosophy.
No member of the United States Armed Forces may be compelled in any way to witness or engage in any religious exercise.
No member of the military may be compelled to curtail – except in the most limited of military circumstances and when it directly impacts military discipline, morale and the successful completion of a specific military goal – the free exercise of their religious practices or beliefs.
No member of the military may be compelled to endure unwanted religious proselytization, evangelization or persuasion of any sort in a military setting and/or by a military superior or civilian employee of the military.
The full exercise of religious freedom includes the right not to subscribe to any particular religion or religious philosophy. The so-called “unchurched” cede no Constitutional rights by want of their separation from organized faith.
It is the responsibility of the military hierarchy to ensure that the free exercise of religious freedoms of all personnel are respected and served.
——————————
Like you, we recognize that the landscape of religion and spirituality in America is wildly diverse.  Every citizen across that plurality of belief (including non-belief) is entitled to the same Constitutional rights and protections, including every member of the US military.  It is on behalf of those military members that the MRFF does what we do.
Lastly, your observation about some of the critical correspondence we receive is right on the mark.  It is usually anonymous and cowardly; generally uninformed; and often nasty, hateful, and anti-Semitic.  Whenever I read one of those idiotic emails, my commitment to the efforts of the MRFF is only strengthened and magnified.
Thanks again for this polite, intelligent exchange.
Peace, MC

 

 

 

 

 

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16 Comments

  1. American Patriot

    “I live my life according to the Beatitudes, Sermon on the Mount, “love your neighbor as yourself” and “as you done it unto the least of these you have done it unto Me.”

    Dear Joan, is that all you live you life by, what about the Great Commission, that we should make disciples of all the nations? How about that women should not be senior pastors according to 1 Timothy. What about exhorting those who are caught in sin, like homosexuality, pornography, no-fault divorce, pre-marital sex, etc to repent and come back to the Lord? What about “preaching the gospel in season as well as out of season.” What about casting a brother or sister out of the church if they will not repent of their sin, giving them over to Satan?

  2. Connie

    I see AP the pig* favors the dogma advocated by the apostles instead of focusing on the words of Jesus. Telling pig. Very telling.

    * I call American Patriot ‘the pig’ because pigs believe all animals are created equal but some are more equal than others as it is stated in George Orwell’s book Animal Farm.

  3. G

    Gee AP, what about people especially wealthy people violating the 10th Commandments or thinking that if they repent on their death bed, they wouldn’t be going to Hades?

  4. American Patriot

    Space Cadet ( Connie),
    That dogma you referred to by the apostles is just as authoritative and inspired as the words of Christ!! Bet that is one thing you never realized. “All scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction and training in righteousness.” 1 Timothy 3:16. All scripture means just that all scripture even that written by the apostles.

  5. Connie

    Sigh. Right. Because the many revisions, all written by men, had nothing to do with the exclusion of the books written by women or with reinforcing archaic rules ensuring the subjugation of women.

    Jesus spoke the truth. In my experience the apostles meant well but were more ‘men of their time’, not enlightened beings.

    Space Cadet – cute. What are you? Ten?

  6. G

    ““All scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction and training in righteousness.” 1 Timothy 3:16. All scripture means just that all scripture even that written by the apostles.”

    I have read 1 Timothy 3:16 in several different versions of the Bible and it doesn’t say anything that you are saying, AP.

  7. American Patriot

    G,
    Well G I am not sure what version you are reading, but all the versions I have in my library all say the same thing!!

  8. American Patriot

    Connie,
    There were no books written by women and the bible does not speak about the subjugation of women either. When you read and interpret scripture you have to take into effect what the cultural norms were at that time in the Hebrew culture.

    Also, all versions today take the best Hebrew and Greek manuscripts to translate from, so that idea of copies from copies from copies is a fallacy. Also, God would make sure that the inerrency of His Word would continue on. The original writers of the books of scripture were all writing under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, so in all actuality, the Word of God was not written by men alone, but men under the guidance and leading of the Holy Spirit.

  9. Connie

    Pig insists the bible doesn’t subjugate women yet quotes verses from Timothy at Pastor Joan which chides her for being a senior pastor while female. O_o

    My brain hurts from the illogical thoughts spewed by the fingers of AP the pig. I am positive that what I mean by subjugation and what pig thinks the word means are as different as light and dark.

  10. G

    ““All scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction and training in righteousness.” 1 Timothy 3:16 ” All scripture means just that all scripture even that written by the apostles.

    Where are the above phrases that you put in quotes are stated in 1 Timothy 3:16 because I don’t see them.

  11. American Patriot

    Oops, got the wrong epistle, it is 2 Timothy 3:16.

  12. American Patriot

    Then G,
    There is also 2 Peter 1:21 – For no prophecy was ever produced by the will of man, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit.

  13. American Patriot

    Connie,
    The bible does not subjugate women. Jesus elevated the position of women in the Hebrew culture. However, God does have a divine order how He wanted His church to be run. Women are not to be senior pastors, but they can be associate pastors as long as they are under the covering of a male pastor. God also has a divine order to the home, the man is to be the head of the home and the wife comes under him and along side him and then children come under the parents.

    I know one thing you are probably thinking of when scripture says that a women is to keep silent in the church. Consider the culture at the time, men sat on one side and women sat on the other side, the same that happens in Orthodox Jewish synagogues today as it is at the Western Wall in Israel, there is the man’s section and the women’s section separated from each other. What Paul is saying here is that if the woman has a question, she should wait until after the service to ask her husband instead of yelling across the synagogue to ask him. That is why Paul said why a woman is to remain silent in the church. In our churches today, women sit right next to their husband or boyfriend so it is okay for them to whisper to their husband or boyfriend a question she might have about what the pastor said or what the bible is saying.

    At my church we have a woman worship leader, the pastor and his wife both preach at times and that is okay because she is under the covering of her husband.

  14. Connie

    Pig, you should have said nothing. Your entire comment just proved my point. Thank you.

  15. G

    “For no prophecy was ever produced by the will of man, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit.”

    Yeah, AP, and most of Catholics were brainwashed that the pope was infallible.

    ” it is 2 Timothy 3:16.”

    Boy, you screw up on that one, AP and regarding the Bible when it comes to for correction and training in righteous, well it funk when it comes to the people who are being picked for that illegitimate president’s cabinet.

  16. G

    “Also, all versions today take the best Hebrew and Greek manuscripts to translate from, so that idea of copies from copies from copies is a fallacy. Also, God would make sure that the inerrency of His Word would continue on. The original writers of the books of scripture were all writing under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, so in all actuality, the Word of God was not written by men alone, but men under the guidance and leading of the Holy Spirit.”

    Oh really, AP. Did the writers of these scriptures actually feel the Holy Spirit in their bodies or actually see the Holy Spirit? Or did the Holy Spirt actually come down and told the writers what to write?

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