Inbox deluge

On Mar 6, 2019, at 1:05 PM, (name withheld) wrote:

Your inbox is deluged with hate mail?  Go figure………Now that you’ve had your 15 minutes of fame and stabbed 98% of your fellow veterans in the back, you think you could go ahead and lock up your cum suck now?  (miltary term, not sure if you actually know it)

Lets raise money for your cause.  How about an octagon match, you versus me?  All legal and on the up and up.  All profits go to your charity and I’ll give mine Wounded Warriors…..50/50 split.  Oh, by the way, this is a legit invitation. I bet Vegas would roll out the red carpet.  You’ll like that part, yes?  All the attention?  Think of all the good we could do for veterans!  Your charity, WW.  They would make a fortune!  And for the record, I’m not affiliated with WW, didn’t want them to get too upset when you have a meltdown over this email.

You in?  Of course not, you won’t even have the balls to respond, I’m sure you lost them years ago from the looks of it.


Response from MRFF Founder and President Mikey Weinstein

From: Mikey Weinstein <[email protected]militaryreligiousfreedom.org>
Date: March 6, 2019 at 1:11:31 PM MST
To: (name withheld)
Cc: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Inbox deluge
Hi there, (name withheld)… Well, guess what, sport?… You are wrong again… This is actually Mikey Weinstein here…Replying to you within minutes… How about we simply have a televised knowledge test?!… We can start with state capitals and then move on  to something a little more simple so that you can compete effectively?…

On Mar 6, 2019, at 1:34 PM, (name withheld) wrote:

Are you interested in answering my question before asking one of your own?  I’ll tell you what, to avoid the smoke and mirrors round about you things engage in, I’ll agree to your television request if you agree to the charity fundraiser?  Or, I’ll skip the charity fundraiser if you agree the televised ‘test’ will take place in the auditorium at Quantico?  I know a choice is hard for you but it’s not all that hard, you can do it.  I actually still have a little FAITH in you……..

The hardest part of the decision would actually be what channel to have televise both.  I’m thinking HBO for the octagon and maybe we should go with a combination of channels for the test.  I think BBC America would be best for television, less hatred and bias here in America.   Maybe over there they are at home in Britain, but they’re the least biased over here.
Oh, I’ll be bringing the bible that belonged to my wife’s grandfather.  He too had it while in a POW camp in Germany.  You might or might not sue to stop me since I suggested a military base for the test, but, whatever.  Not like that would stop me from bringing it anyway.
So, I await your reply there stud!
(name withheld)

Response from MRFF Founder and President Mikey Weinstein
From: Mikey Weinstein <[email protected]militaryreligiousfreedom.org>
Date: March 6, 2019 at 1:39:14 PM MST
To: (name withheld)
Cc: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Inbox deluge
I can see that the state capital test really hit a nerve… No offense but we’re a little busy here protecting the constitution from low intelligent, high prejudice specimens such as you, (name withheld)… Now don’t get your feelings hurt… Remember that I DID say that after the state capitals, we would come up with questions that will be much simpler so that it won’t be like analogizing to bringing a butter knife to a gun fight for this knowledge test…

On Mar 6, 2019, at 1:50 PM, (name withheld) wrote:

That’s what I figured….never can actually address a comment or question, just spout off and make accusations of some sort of bigotry, racism or whatever.  I was wondering how long it would take for you to make the attempt at playing that card, didn’t take long, did it?  Crawl back in your hate hole. Anything to never ever address the question or comment.  How in the world would you engage in any test?  Test have questions!  Oh don’t worry, the Constitution is definitely in good hands, those hands just don’t belong to you.   Also, don’t worry, the hands they are in will still cover your back too.
(name withheld)

Response from MRFF Founder and President Mikey Weinstein
From: Mikey Weinstein <[email protected]militaryreligiousfreedom.org>
Date: March 6, 2019 at 1:54:35 PM MST
To:  (name withheld)
Cc:[email protected]
Subject: Inbox deluge
Hey, brother, I think you are late for a book burning… Better get on the go there, eh?!

On Mar 6, 2019, at 2:04 PM,  (name withheld) wrote:

And the hate, accusations and rhetoric continue, but no answer.  Not exactly sure what seminal moment in your lifetime caused you to have such anger and hatred but a part of me does have a little sympathy for you, the world is a tough place and not everyone can handle it.  But, you keep on, you’re entertaining a lot of us at the moment during your meltdown.

So, when is the test?  Are you ready?  No smart phones on stage, no earpieces in your ears.  You’ll have to do this on your own but, again, I still have faith in you that you can.
I’ll be here when you’ve calmed down and want to move forward with your suggestion.
(name withheld)

Response from MRFF Founder and President Mikey Weinstein
From: Michael L Weinstein <[email protected]>
Date: March 6, 2019 at 2:18:07 PM MST
To: (name withheld)
Cc:[email protected]
Subject: Re: Inbox deluge
OK play time is over, little fella… I gave you what you wanted; personal interaction time with me, Mikey Weinstein… You never thought you would it get it and I know you are THRILLED that you got a little bit… Time to go back to confronting fundamentalist Christian enemies who are not pipsqueaks like you… No offense…

Response from MRFF Advisory Board Member Mike Farrell
On Mar 6, 2019, at 3:29 PM, Mike  wrote:

 

Hi (name withheld),

Just a few thoughts from the sidelines, if you don’t mind. I’ve watched this back-and-forth for a bit and think some clarification is in order.

It appears you came in with a head of steam, opening with a derisive comment about Mikey’s mention of the flood of negative messages that have come our way as a result of the publicity about our opposition to a Bible on a POW/MIA table (also known as a “Missing Man” table). You followed with an inference that our action was an attempt to get publicity and added a crack suggesting our position was an insult to 98% of veterans.

There’s a lot wrong there, but rather than quibble, let me just ask if you actually think only 2% of our “fellow veterans,” as you put it, have a faith other than Christianity, are non-believers, or are actually Christians who understand why a Bible isn’t appropriate on such a display?

Unless you answer otherwise, I’ll assume that’s your belief.

Then, having begun from anger and basing it on a false premise, you chose to launch into a challenge to a fight, the underlying assumption being that your physical prowess, your personal strength and fighting ability, what I’ll presume you think of as your ‘manhood,’ would allow you to triumph. Aside from the silly riff about a wager, etc., the point you seem to be making is that you’d win and… what?

Do you actually think beating someone in a physical contest, assuming your were able to do so, (remember Goliath), would make the placement of a Bible on a POW/MIA table appropriate? Is that what you learned in church, if you go to church?

There’s really no point in going into the resulting exchanges, but I would point out that Mikey’s initial response to your challenge had an underlying aspect that you failed to grasp. What he was inviting you to do, was to engage your mind – in other words, to get you to think.

You see, when one begins to think about honoring American servicemen who were captured and possibly tortured, or were killed or lost and unaccounted for, one might recognize that this population is made up of people from many different backgrounds and beliefs.That being the case, a Bible might not be the proper way to honor ALL of them, if honoring all of them is what one has in mind.

You see, Bill, the original POW/MIA Table, sometimes known as the MISSING MAN Table, had a prescribed set of items placed on it. It was originated by the VFW Ladies Auxiliary and the National League of POW/MIA Families and later adopted by the American Legion. None of them called for or included a Bible. You see, they understood, as most of those who make up the flood of “hate mail” you mention above do not, that a Christian artifact does not represent, nor does it properly honor, many of those in question. And even if it were to be 2% of them, as you apparently believe, they are just as deserving of honor.

Also, as you apparently do not know, our Constitution, our laws and our military regulations prohibit the imposition of, proselytizing for, or promoting of, even by inference, one faith, religion or belief system over others.

That’s why the MRFF says, along with many others, the Bible doesn’t belong on the POW/MIA Table. And, in my view, protecting the freedom of religious or non-religious choice isn’t something that can be done in the Octagon.

Mike Farrell

(MRFF Board of Advisors)


Response from MRFF Advisory Board Member John Compere

On Mar 6, 2019, at 5:19 PM, John Compere wrote:

(name withheld),
 
Your acrimonious attack on the Founder & President of Military Religious Freedom Foundation (a fellow American & military veteran you do not even know) is misguided, misdirected & moronic.
 
You are in truth & reality attacking over 61,000 military men & women (95% Christians) who have requested their right to religious freedom, to which all Americans are entitled under our US Constitution, be respected & restored. They are fortunate Military Religious Freedom Foundation, whose motto is “Fighting for our service members’ rights, so they can fight for ours,” exists to respond to their pleas for protection. For this advocacy, MRFF has been officially nominated for the Nobel Peace Prize 7 times.
 
It is a challenging & continuing endeavor for our constitutional rights organization of staff, advisors, volunteers & supporters. We have no reason to devote & divert our resources & efforts to other non-profits.
 
Military members, like all Americans, want the right to determine & enjoy their own religious or non-religious beliefs. They do not want someone else’s religious beliefs publicly proselytized on them by the government in government facilities in violation of the Constitution, military regulations, established law & common courtesy. We proudly & patriotically represent them pro bono when requested by them & will continue to do so.
 
It has been our experience that any man who resorts to nasty name-calling of others usually do so because he cannot communicate in a mature or meaningful manner. Surely you have better things to do with your time & life.
 
Most Sincerely,
Brigadier General John Compere, US Army (Retired)
Disabled American Veteran (Vietnam Era)
Advisory Board Member, Military Religious Freedom Foundation (80% Christians)

From: (name withheld)
To: John Compere
Cc: Military Religious Freedom Foundation <[email protected]militaryreligiousfreedom.org>
Sent: Thursday, March 7, 2019, 7:05:20 AM CST
Subject: Re: Fw: Inbox deluge
 

Did you perhaps share that same final sentiment about name calling with Mikey?  I seriously doubt it.

 
Thank you for your service, sir.  Otherwise, please go away.  I won’t tolerate bullies such as yourselves.  Never have, never will.  You attempt to force your beliefs on others, and that makes you bullies, period.
 
Have a good day.
(name withheld)

Response from MRFF Advisory Board Member John Compere
On Mar 7, 2019, at 6:43 AM, John Compere  wrote:

 

In others words, do not contradict my closed mind with reason, facts & law

On Thu, Mar 7, 2019 at 5:08 AM  (name withheld) wrote:
Thank you for your reply, Mike.  I’m sorry that you’ve felt the need to step in here but can totally understand.

With all due respect, sir, I don’t believe you understood a single piece of the back and forth with Mr. Mikey.  You’re reply was simply one sided and continued to push your agenda.  I seriously doubt anyone has had any conversation with Mr. Mikey about his attitude, I don’t care if you have.
You’re bullies, pure and simple.  You attempt to force your beliefs on others and that’s the most simple definition of the term there is.  Period.
Have a nice day, sir.
(name withheld)

Response from MRFF Advisory Board Member Mike Farrell
On Mar 7, 2019, at 11:00 PM, Mike wrote:
Hi (name withheld),

You’re welcome, but what is it I didn’t understand? I thought it was pretty clear: you disagree with our position, you think Mikey is in it for publicity and is stabbing vets in the back. You went on to suggest you’d whip him in a fight that, as a fillip, you said could raise money for vets.

As I said, pretty clear. You don’t like Mikey and you don’t agree with what you think he’s trying to do. I think the challenge to fight was a kind of juvenile way to express your anger, but, you know, to each his own.

My point was to try to explain what the MRFF is about and why we do what we do. Apparently I didn’t succeed, but I’m not at all sure how that qualifies as bullying.

Our “agenda,” as you put it, is to make sure military organizations abide by the Constitution, the law and military regulations regarding religion, the promotion of which they should not be doing. I take it you have a problem with that. I get it, and of course you’re welcome to your opinion. But the law is on our side. I wish more people understood that. And it’s not about us promoting a religion or any belief system, it’s about protecting everyone’s right to believe as she or he chooses.

I’m sure Mikey has people talk to him about his attitude. He’s certainly not always pugnacious, I’ve seen him be quite kind and thoughtful, but he sure can come on strong when he feels it necessary.. Some think it’s appropriate, for others if not appropriate at least understandable given the degree of garbage that comes his way. He’s regularly threatened with death, called an atheist, a communist, a dirty Jew and a lot of other things. A lot of antisemitism comes his way; interestingly, the worst of the attacks are from people who claim to be Christians.

As regards forcing beliefs on others, I think you’ve got it backward. We’re not forcing anyone to believe anything. We’re fine with what anyone wants to believe; that’s what the freedom of religious choice is about. What we don’t tolerate is people forcing their beliefs on those in the military, even if their belief, as in Christianity, is the dominant faith in the country. You see, in founding this country, those responsible didn’t want there to be a national religion to which everyone must belong. They”d seen that and didn’t like it. Just like they didn’t want to have a king. They wanted people to be free to choose their own belief system – including non-belief if that’s their choice – and go on their merry way having whatever relationship they chose with God or a church or a mountain or a tree or a snowstorm. As it is, while most of our staff, supporters and clients are Christians, we welcome people of all faiths and no faith.

As far as the Bible on the table is concerned, as I said in my earlier message, it’s wrong to suggest it represents all POWs, MIAs or Missing Men. A military installation should have churches or places of worship for all those who want one, but it shouldn’t pick out an artifact of one belief for a display that is meant to honor people of different beliefs.

I realize I’ve gone on some, but I think it’s important to try to find understanding, if not agreement. I hope you don’t just see it as bullying.

Mike Farrell

(MRFF Board of Advisors)


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3 Comments

  1. Sandra Bell

    Brilliant responses everyone. If I may make my own contribution. I am a veteran, an independent, a woman, an atheist or as I would like to say an anti-theist, I follow philosophies, mainly of kindness and compassion, and I go to the Manchester VA Clinic. As soon as I saw that bible on display, I turned on my heels and complained to the patient advocate. For me, the god of Abraham is an immoral one and Catholicism, of which the Bible in question is of, is a well-oiled sect that protects their child raping priests, who go to Africa with the belief that AIDS and unessessary births in a poverty-stricken land are better than condoms. The Christian Bible offends me because their god is oppressive, telling people what to eat and on what day, who to sleep with and in what way, to love him, but to fear him, the essence of sadomasochism, and he supports human sacrifice, genital mutilation and women as chattel (see the 10 commandments). I’ve had enough of people that think there is nothing offensive about their beliefs to others. You can enjoy your beliefs all you want, but leave me out of it. Keep it out of my face. Because extraordinary claims requires extraordinary evidence of which there is none and so I’m sorry, I hate to say it, I’m pretty sure this is all man-made and as if that isn’t enough, it is pretty wicked and shame-based. I’m sorry, but you people will never be able to justify it being on display anywhere other than in your home or your church, let alone to honor people you know nothing about. I don’t care that it is an “artifact”. So are mines, grenades and dog tags. What makes this special? OH because you people deem it as such. This belief system is oppressive towards just about anyone that is not a heterosexual male. It is holding our society back and the sooner people realize that, the sooner our species will evolve. I will not have a wicked text on a missing MAN table. Speaking of which, why the hell is it called a missing man table? I get the alliterative thing, that’s nice, but women have been POWs. I think I will save that battle for another day. I will leave it at this: it is repugnant to have a Bible of any sort on display. It is arrogant and it seems like some people have no clue what harm religion can and has done to people. Legality aside, do you really want your fellow veterans, even one, to look at that table and think of child rape? I wouldn’t. Not too honoring is it. Especially if one of those vets or POWs were a victim of that church’s crimes. No doubt at least one was. Makes my stomach turn. Anyone that still wants to beat the drum for this ridiculous fight to put this dangerous and immoral doctrine on a POW table should be ashamed of themselves.

  2. Dwayne Free

    Let’s see. The VA shouldn’t assume that a bible represents 100% of veteran’s belief systems. We really shouldn’t assume that this rust picking, scum bag represents 98% of navy veterans. But, his words reflect very poorly on the Navy and 100% of it’s veterans. Depending on how long ago he left the Navy, he should be court martial’ed, ASAP. I assume MRFF has Navy-Veteran clients that would like to see their names cleared, as well.

  3. Ironmoped

    Mr. Weinstein,
    Not sure how you do it (put up with these knuckleheads

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