MRFF Demands that Air Force Base Gate Guards Immediately Cease Wearing “In God We Trust” Tab on Uniform
After receiving several complaints about a gate guard at Kirtland Air Force Base in New Mexico violating Air Force uniform regulations as well as very visibly promoting his religious beliefs by wearing an “IN GOD WE TRUST” tab on his uniform, MRFF has sent the airman’s command a demand that “these ‘In God We Trust’ patches … be immediately removed from the duty uniforms of all members of the 377 Air Base Wing’s Security Forces Group and Squadron.”
When questioned by one retired officer as to why he was wearing the unauthorized “IN GOD WE TRUST” tab, the gate guard’s motive-confirming response was: “I am a Christian sooo.”
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You morons. You should stop using currency since it says it on every dollar you spend, but you wouldnt do that since it would affect you personally.
Loser Mrff gang
Oh you silly troll who is in no way connected to the MRFF, admin or otherwise.
Your argument is stale, as in expiration date year 2000 stale.
To your point though – several bills were introduced to remove all forms of deity from our currency only to be stopped by Nationalist Christians as their heads exploded. We The People are still cleaning up the mess (there were many heads).
Once you and yours finish imploding this will be an item on the To Do list. Thanks ever so much for the reminder.
“When all religions are banned from the public square the responsibility will lie entirely with the Nationalist Christian movement.”
I guess they should have learned how to share.
The principles and foundation this Country was built on might not mean shit to the 2% of you liberal jackass mental cases out there, but it damn sure means something to the rest of us. The days of catering to the insane 2% of the populations are just about over.
Back to my point though… If you are so opposed to the phrase tied to Federal currency, you would stop using it right? Or in this case your morals and principles are outweighed by your financial needs and convenience right? In theory, you would go out of your way to pay for everything by debit card, credit card, or other electronic means rather than carrying around something you detest in your pocketbook. But you guys won’t make that sacrifice, youll just keep picking low hanging fruit from the tree and call it a “win” where you can. You have no real demonstrable convictions.
“The principles and foundation this Country was built on might not mean shit to the 2% of you liberal jackass mental cases” says the theocrat who denies that one of the “principles and foundation this Country was built on” is “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion.” (Recognize where those words are quoted from?)
What specific “principles and foundation this Country was built on” do you claim doesn’t “mean shit” to us “liberals”?
What part do you not understand of Force Instruction (AFI) 1-1, Section 2.12, which states:
2.12. Balance of Free Exercise of Religion and Establishment Clause. Leaders at all levels must balance constitutional protections for their own free exercise of religion, including individual expressions of religious beliefs, and the constitutional prohibition against governmental establishment of religion. They must ensure their words and actions cannot reasonably be construed to be officially endorsing or disapproving of, or extending preferential treatment for any faith, belief, or absence of belief.
“Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.” – John Adams
Lets not pretend for one second that this Country was founded on anything other than Judeo-Christian values. You can spin “church and state” anyway you want, but you are living in fantasy land if you think the founding fathers would be on board with your bullshit.
Troll with the ever increasing hierarchical names: Show your work. Please point out exactly what was exclusively “ Judeo-Christian” values.
If indeed the founding fathers thought religion was an integral part of governing, why did they write the First Amendment to the Constitution the way that they did?
What you posted troll was one man’s personal opinion. Like all humans we each have opinions (and other body parts that are equally stinky).
Troll, take your Dave Barton inspired interpretation of history and peddle it elsewhere. Some of us actually read the journals and books written before ole Dave’s father had a gleam in his eye. Your version of history is interesting to listen to but in no way is it accurate.
I ask, what is more threatening? A military (and for that matter a nation) that protects all citizens from imposed religious edicts and stands guard against fundamentalist movements from within OR a military that that endorses and protects a particular religious view over all others?
Taliban-like terror is not just a threat in Islamic countries – it’s a threat to any country that would let a religious sect control every aspect of people’s liberties.
As an AD military service member, I fight for everyone’s right to choose their ideologies but will also fight to the death any one who threatens to formalize and force a religious ideology on to the American people! Religious extremism is religious extremism even if it happens to be the religion you prefer. I, for one, do not prefer YOUR religion. Do not force it upon me.
George Washington – avid churchgoer and self-proclained Christian. “Thou gavest Thy Son to die for me”.
Thomas Jefferson – Considered teaching of Jesus Christ “the most sublime and benevolent code of morals which has ever been offered to man”. Referred to himself as a Christian.
John Adams – “Now I will avow, that I then believed, and now believe, that those general principles of Christianity are as eternal and immutable, as the existence and attributes of God.”
Ben Franklin – Although not Christian, “As to Jesus of Nazareth, I think the system of morals and his religion, as he left them to us, the best the world ever saw or is likely to see”.
Alexander Hamilton – thought Christianity formed the basis of all law and mortality, and that the “world would be a hellish place without it”. Also said ” The praise of a civilized world is justly due to Christianity”.
John Jay (Devout Christian) – “I very concisely remarked that if there was no God there could be no moral obligations, and that I did not see how society could subsist without them”
James Madison (speaking about Christianity) – “The simple question to be decided is whether a support of the BEST and PUREST religion, the Christian religion”…etc.
So please, tell me again how the founding fathers weren’t influenced by Christianity in their decision making and moral compass.
Sure they wanted some separation, a wall, but you are a fool if you deny America was founded on Christian morals and beliefs.
Major Tom,
“I ask, what is more threatening? A military (and for that matter a nation) that protects all citizens from imposed religious edicts and stands guard against fundamentalist movements from within OR a military that that endorses and protects a particular religious view over all others?”
Kindly explain how a couple of guards wearing “In God We Trust” on their sleeves equates to protecting a particular religion? I’d love to hear the mental gymnastics to get there
mrff shall hang
Not sure how the trolls missed the idea that a person may hold religious ideals for their personal life. No one is saying a person can’t practice whatever faith they want.
What the trolls do is equate a founding fathers personal expression of faith with laws that govern the USA. Really obvious trolls that you either never watched Sesame Street or if you did, the lesson of ‘One of these things is not like the other’ was too hard for you.
When a person is serving their country, either in the military or government, while in uniform, any and all expressions of religious faith are forbidden. I believe there are rules about these things.
Everyone (except the trolls) know for a fact that if a person who is not a Christian assumed the same privilege the Nationalist Christians take for themselves heads and by extension letters to the editor would be explosive.
What’s the harm the troll asks. Just asking questions they’ve said time after time.
I call horse poop on the trolls. You want a religious government? Find another country. This one is secular by design.
By the way trolls, if you and those of your faith are so super duper in the moral sense, why have I been reading story after story of evangelical and fundamentalist Christian pastors arrested for child endangerment?
Do as I say and not as I do? Hell of a way to prove your moral superiority.
*I haven’t kept a strict running tally but I’ve read of at least three unique cases each week for the past four months. I guess it is true, accusations are confessions.
I dunno, if BLM are so super duper in the moral sense, why do they have a statue of a scumbag drug addict multiple felon who held a gun to a pregnant woman’s stomache as their idol? Also why do they commit fraud and embezzle money? Why does Hunter Biden smoke crack and fuck prostitutes? Why does Joe Biden blatantly lie about student loan forgiveness and try and shake hands with people who arent present? Why does Heels-Up Harris found the “root cause” of the border crisis? Why does Nancy Pelosis husband make millions off of insider trading? These are the hard hitting questions.
And there it is, the moving of goal posts, the introduction of straw arguments because the troll has nothing of substance on the original topic, Nationalist Christians taking advantage and violating their oath to defend the Constitution of the USA.
Trolls gotta troll, it is who they are.
Already provided plenty of substance there for you. You are just too obtuse to comprehend any of it.
Well, yes there is substance to what the troll wrote but is it factual? No.
But please, tell me again how obtuse I am for not swallowing propaganda from the cult of trolls.
“Lets not pretend for one second that this Country was founded on anything other than Judeo-Christian values.” What specifically “Judeo-Christian values” are those?
How does the fact that the people who created the U.S.A. were religious make it acceptable for government to violate the Constitution by promoting religion
More specific to the above article: why is it acceptable for on-duty military people to violate the AF regulation I quoted at 6:19PM on 12/20?
“you are a fool if you deny America was founded on Christian morals and beliefs”
Which specifically “Christian morals and beliefs” was America supposedly founded on?
Bro, put your analytical thinking cap on for like two seconds. It’s pretty simple stuff.
If all of the founding fathers were heavily influenced by Christianity and the message of Jesus Christ, which they were, then it is pretty safe to assume that when making decisions and forming their ideas…they would refer back to their perception of Christian morality to guide them through that process. Hence the Christian influence…
I’m not sure why we are struggling to grasp this concept.
Trolls didn’t say ‘heavily influenced’, they said “ Lets not pretend for one second that this Country was founded on anything other than Judeo-Christian values. You can spin “church and state” anyway you want, but you are living in fantasy land if you think the founding fathers would be on board with your bullshit.”
So, where are the receipts? Moving the goalposts (again) makes Troll look weak and their argument lame.
In preparing for this debate it’s obvious to me Troll did not read up on the founding fathers aside from Googling a few quotes taken out of context. If they had completed more exhaustive research they would have discovered to a person the founding fathers agreed to the separation between church and state based on their recent history. Google the timeline. Good theater out of that period if massively depressing. Good humans killed because of out of control dogma always leaves me tired.
It is historically accurate to say allowing region control of state government always leads to unending war. For motive I suggest reading Emo Phillips Greatest Joke Ever.
The Treaty of Tripoli says “the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion.” The treaty was negotiated by emissaries appointed by Pres. George Washington, was signed by Pres. John Adams, and ratified UNANIMOUSLY without debate by the US senate in June 1797, while most of the Founding Fathers were still alive and many were still active in politics.
Why did the people who allegedly founded the US government on Christian principles negotiate and ratify a treaty which explicitly says the opposite?
Also, notice that the theocrats haven’t even tried to answer the questions in my last two comments (because they can’t.)
OL MIKEY WEINSTEIN TO THE RESCUE YET AGAIN, DISGUSTING YID, GO TO ISRAEL AND NEVER COME BACK YOU FUCKING TRAITOR.
It’s OK if you don’t understand.
Turbans are now allowed in uniform as well as beards to adhere to religious beliefs…. If so approved then why can’t any other religious belief be discretely displayed. We can go trans but not religious? There is a real problem here.
Thats actually a great point about the turbans and beards and yarmulkes. The rules only seem to apply to the Christian faith. Btw there is no such thing as “trans”, you either have xy or xx.
Turbans and beards don’t have religious slogans written on them, and are not inherently religious symbols. I know of no religion that requires its followers to wear the words “in god we trust” on their clothing.
Bill thinks they are making a point by stating “ We can go trans but not religious?”
Being Transgender is a state of being, religion is a choice.
Also, there is that pesky 1st Amendment Establishment Clause which must be followed when representing the military or government as indicated by the wearing of an official uniform.
Tom, you conveniently forgot to mention yarmulkes in your last post, which IS inherently a religous symbol.
The 6:14 comment about yarmulkes was posted while I was typing my reply to Bill’s 5:29 comment, so I didn’t see it until after I posted mine.
Same principle applies: wearing of yarmulkes is required by some branches of Judaism. What religion requires its followers to wear the words “in god we trust” on their clothing?
Yet you can’t decline a covid shot based on your religious beliefs. Outrageous.
Refusing vaccinations increases the risk of spreading disease among people who work in close proximity to each other. Soldiers getting sick could seriously degrade a military unit’s ability to do its job. That’s why the military has required vaccinations since George Washington required all his soldiers be vaccinated for smallpox
What religion forbids Covid vaccines but not other vaccines?
Let’s just say a religion forbade all vaccines. We are still picking and choosing which religious beliefs are respected… Should be all or none. Vaccines and Yarmulkes for everyone, or no vaccines or yarmulkes for anyone.
Troll is so close… they said “Let’s just say a religion forbade all vaccines. We are still picking and choosing which religious beliefs are respected”
The whole reason church is on one side and state the other is exactly for this reason. Which faith then gets to decide? And before anyone says ‘Christian’ (the USA default in the here/now) I would remind folks of Emo Phillips Greatest Joke ever told.
Secular government means no one faith controls the narrative, just as the founding fathers intended.
Emo Phillips The best God joke ever told:
Once I saw this guy on a bridge about to jump. I said, “Don’t do it!” He said, “Nobody loves me.”
I said, “God loves you. Do you believe in God?” He said, “Yes.”
I said, “Are you a Christian or a Jew?” He said, “A Christian.” I said, “Me, too! Protestant or Catholic?” He said, “Protestant.”
I said, “Me, too! What franchise?” He said, “Baptist.” I said, “Me, too! Northern Baptist or Southern Baptist?” He said, “Northern Baptist.”
I said, “Me, too! Northern Conservative Baptist or Northern Liberal Baptist?”
He said, “Northern Conservative Baptist.”
I said, “Me, too! Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region, or Northern Conservative Baptist Eastern Region?” He said, “Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region.”
I said, “Me, too!” Northern Conservative†Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1879, or Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912?” He said, “Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912.”
I said, “Die, heretic!” And I pushed him over.
But please, tell me again how the label Christian has only one definition.
The evidence is clear to me. I guess the quote by Upton Sinclair is true – one can’t convince a person of a thing if their paycheck (or communal standing) depends on them not getting it.
“Let’s just say a religion forbade all vaccines.” Followers of that religion shouldn’t join organizations that require vaccines.
“We are still picking and choosing which religious beliefs are respected.” WRONG!! We are “picking and choosing which religious beliefs” allow activities which are essential to the military’s ability to do their job.
Sick soldiers can’t do their jobs: soldiers with beards or wearing turbans or yarmulkes can. There’s a BIG difference between respecting a person’s religious beliefs and allowing that person to DO things that have negative effects on others.
The ability to distinguish between similarities is a basic measure of intelligence. Attempting to equate similar, but different, things is a basic propagandist’s technique.
@Grey One Talks Sass,
“Being Transgender is a state of being, religion is a choice.” Being transgender or gay or bi-sexual is a matter of choice just as much as being religious. There is no gay or transgender gene, both are a conscious sinful choice of heart and mind. No one is born gay or transgender. Since G-d is the Creator, when He created you with a penis or a vagina and breasts, it was for the purpose of being either a male or female and He does not give a rats ass what you may feel or think what you are.
So John, when did you choose to be heterosexual?
I mean since you say it’s a choice did you do your research? Check out other options?
Your definition of sex and gender are based in the Bronze Age. Humans have grown since those days following either their deity or lack of one to make things better. And you want to drag us back?
Get thee behind me John Fletcher
It occurs to me (late of course) that I conflated sexual preference with gender. That is on me. And, I know better.
The spectrum of gender has nothing to do with who one likes to canoodle with, and I offer my most sincere apologies to those I offended. I promise to do better.
And… the new way of speaking is hard for this old one.
I am gently reminded the word is orientation, not preference.
I prefer cheese.
My sexual orientation is pansexual.
The two statements are not the same.
When I know better I do better.
John is wrong about the choice of gay/straight hetero/homo. It is a variation in male or female brain activity and probably hormones. You can definitely be male and be attracted to males, you can definitely be female and be attracted to females. This is your brain chemistry. There is also brain chemistry telling you that you are a male who wants to be a woman or a woman that wants to be a man. Thats fine, its unfortunate for the latter groups as it is a mental disorder (gender dysphoria). However in the end, there is only male and female chromosomes. XX or XY. You are either male or female and no amount of pretend or fantasy can change that. There are only two sexes and you can’t change yours. You can identify with whatever you want, you are still not it though.
Troll above said “However in the end, there is only male and female chromosomes. XX or XY.”
Huh. Really? Because I did a quick search online and found humans can be: X, XX, XXY, XY, or XYY.
So Troll are you saying the additional options aren’t human? Because that’s what it sounds like to me.
Humanity is a spectrum where male/female are two options just not the only options.
You were too busy frothing at the mouth to do enough research. If you had spent a few extra minutes researching as you were seething, you’d find that a single X is A FEMALE ONLY disorder as described in every credible medical book in the world. So you have to be female to have this disorder.
XXYand XYY is a MALE ONLY abnormality as described in every credible medical book in the world… So you have to be male to have it.
They are still human, and still either male or female. Try harder.
Troll, you said two options. You listed them. I found more and you promptly moved your goalposts and assumed emotions for me I did not express.
You too need to do better; I’m not holding my breath as that is a wait for a train that doesn’t arrive.
The goal posts are still that there are only two sexes. That never changed, still well within the posts on that one. Thanks.
How is this argument about gender identity in ANY way relevant to the article you’re supposedly commenting on?
How is your comment on my comment related to it? It’s not, just like mine is an offshoot of someone elses comment, yours is also.
“How is your comment on my comment related to it?” (assuming that “it” means the above article) My comment is a reminder that the discussion here has gone totally off-topic.
It’s a waste of time and energy to argue with people who are so disconnected from reality that they try to claim that a person can choose which gender they feel sexually attracted to.
Tom O – yeah, I went off base when the troll equated the wearing of religious items, vaccines, gender identity, and sexual orientation as all the same.
If in my personal life I’d not suffered the death of my niece who identified as Transgender I might have been able to resist their Gish Gallop. Now? Suffice it to say if I was the Hulk I’’m in Hulk Smash mode.
That said, facts state gender identity and sexual orientation are expressions of who we are as humans. To include this issue in the discussion is a red herring. Shame on me for falling for it.
Vaccines are science and necessary especially in the military to ensure one person doesn’t infect the rest of the population. Including this issue is another red herring.
As it’s been said many times, religion has no place in making decisions or laws for government, no matter how much the Nationalist Christian trolls want to make it so. Equating required by faith headgear or specific hair/beard style is not the same as blatantly displaying a religious catch phrases on one’s uniform.
Hopefully this places the conversation back on track: the blatant refusal of Nationalist Christians to abide by the rules which govern military and government employees.
Hows that goin for yall?
Seems like they arent budging on this one.
Good.
“Seems like they arent budging on this one.” They’re ignoring complaints thinking MRFF will give up. They’re going to find out the hard way how wrong they are when they have to explain to a Senate subcommittee why they think they can blatantly violate AF uniform regulations. Look at
https://www.militaryreligiousfreedom.org/2023/01/mrff-legal-counsel-sends-demand-to-air-force-base-after-non-response-to-complaints-of-gate-guards-wearing-in-god-we-trust-tab-on-uniform/#comment-745888